I've gone back and forth on the 6mm Creedmoor, 6.5 Creedmoor, 260 Rem, 6mm Dasher, and the 6XC so many time my head is spinning! Make sure you subscribe toThe Big Game Hunting Podcastand follow The Big Game Hunting Blog onFacebook,Instagram,Twitter, andYouTube. Comparing 6mm ARC to 6mm CR is is apples and oranges again. Top Precision Rifle Shooter Bryan Zolnikov Talks With LoadDevelopment.com. Im shooting 108eldm out of my 6mm creedmoor and really messing them up. With barrels of equal lengths and a 200-yard zero, the 6.5 ELD Match bullet drops 6 inches more at 500 yards than the 6mm ELD Match. All things considered though, the three cartridges are very accurate, flat shooting, and hit hard enough for use on a wide variety of game at practical hunting ranges. A 6.5 Creedmoor barrel typically lasts between 2,000 and 3,000 rounds, while the 6mm Creedmoor experiences serious velocity drops starting between 1,500 and 1,800 rounds. Only a few metric calibers have been really popular in the United . However, the extra recoil is not enough to make the Creedmoor unmanageable for most shooters. So, I decided to include this those handloads to give an idea of how their performance compares when using the same type and weight bullet. In general, the bigger the bullet, the better it will perform on game animals. This helps us keep this site going, and does not affect the price you would pay usually in any way whatsoever. Barrel life variable depend on your rifle, barrel, load, velocity and bullet. Deviating from Soviet design, the ARC takes on a 30-degree shoulder angle; this is common with . 6mmARC, 6mmGT, 6mmXC and the 6 creed. 224 Valkyrie. As a result, the NRA is forced to restrict the sending of certain materials and information into California. This shows that HORI is confident in the longevity of the new ARC, and it should give players some peace of mind as well. This is especially true when relative availability of the 2 cartridges during the ongoing ammo shortage are taken into account. The 6.5 Creedmoor is Not the Ultimate Super Cartridge Not much comparison if you ask me. I think my buddy said 2700 fps rather than 2750 fps out of a 18" barrel. As a follow-up exercise, I plan to use QuickDesign software to create a more accurate model for the 6mm . It features reinforced construction and stronger materials throughout, which should help it withstand the rigors of tournament play. Deer Hunting with .220 Swift, 6mm ARC, or .25-06 Remington? As far as I know I the 6 CM has much more case capacity and higher operating pressures so I'd expect more velocity especially with longer barrels. A large volume of slow burning powder takes more barrel to burn. 6mm Creedmoor vs. 6.5 Creedmoor: Cartridge Clash Like the .243 Winchester, the 6mm Creedmoor is also a really good varmint as well as big game hunting cartridge. With almost 2 of separation at 500 yards, the gap between them is much smaller. 6mm creedmoor vs 6mm ARC in bolt action The cartridge has a big advantage over the .243 Winchester in terms of wind resistance and is almost equal to the 6.5 Creedmoor in that regard. Book an outstandingAfrica huntingsafari here. The .223 75-grain bullet, by contrast, drifts more than 15 inches at that range, and the ARC's advantage becomes more pronounced at longer ranges. The sixmm ARC has enough stopping power to take down small game, but it is not ideal for self-defense against larger animals or humans. Thank you for watching, I hope you guys have a blessed new year. Makes for a crazy lightweight 6.5 grendel in their Howa carbon stalker. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. I shot 87 vmax mostly at 2900 fps or so iirc with 8208. For that reason, it combines incredible accuracy with consistent performance across a wide range of impact velocities. It is also much harder to control on full-automatic. I have a rifle being built for me right now, a Badrock but it is going to be late summer before I see it. As can be seen with the Kudu bull taken at 180 yards late evening with a well place head shot. It had a 2.23-inch case length, a .243-inch pointed soft point bullet diameter, and muzzle energy of 2,788J. This particular .243 Winchester load drops below the speed of sound around 1,150 yards, but the 6mm Creedmoor stays supersonic out until around 1,375 yards and the 6.5 Creedmoor doesnt cross the sound barrier until around 1,450 yards. The sixmm ARC has enough stopping power to take down small game, but it is not ideal for self-defense against larger animals or humans. This is reflected in the prices, availability, and variety of factory ammunition and hunting rifles currently in production for each cartridge. Posted: 3/17/2020 1:36:19 PM EST [#2] Quote History . Team Hornadayis the master, bar none. Wild. Review: Hornady 6mm ARC. The gunsmith would need a 6mm Creedmoor reamer to create a chamber in the barrel for it. So although John Snow from Outdoor Life magazine and website has claimed that it was his idea as early as 2007 but that they only made such a rifle later in 2009 for an article that appeared in the magazine in 2010 (earliest mention I can find of an Outdoor Life magazine that contains an article of a 6mm Creedmoor is of the Aug 2011 issue), that cannot be verified, so we will officially going with Mr Lee Gardner as the first documented person to think of the idea of the 6mm Creedmoor. We have found some 6mm Creedmoor shooters pushing the bullet speeds in excess of 3000 fps to get around 2000 shots out of their barrels, and some have been able to extend that with proper barrel care life letting the 6mm Creedmoor barrel cool between firing strings, and hBN or other coatings on the bullets, or using the Tubb Throat Maintenance System bullets every few hundred shots. Regardless of whether youre using a .243 Winchester, a 6mm Creedmoor, or a 6.5mm Creedmoor, no pronghorn or deer will go far if you put a well constructed bullet into the vitals. You can boost the performance of the 6mm ARC in a bolt action quite easily. Cartridge - Powder Fill % Charge Vel. In this article, Im going to discuss the pros and cons of the 6mm Creedmoor cartridge in detail. The 6mm 109's offer several advantages," said Bryan Litz, Berger's Chief Ballistician. California recently rushed through legislation making it unlawful to communicate to those under 18 about broad categories of firearms, parts, and accessories. 6mm ARC Cartridge SAAMI Specs, Build Requirements, Videos Its also incredibly accurate, making it perfect for long-range shots. I just dont think you could fit a 6 creed in an ar15 platform. Like the Nosler Ballistic Tip ammo, their 6mm Creedmoor Trophy Grade ammo is also best suited for deer sized game. Comparing 6mm ARC to 6mm CR is is apples and oranges again. While the Precision Hunter ammo uses the same type of bullet for all 3 cartridges, the 243 and 6mm Creedmoor use different weight bullets with that line of ammo. Head to Head: .243 Winchester vs. 6mm Creedmoor | An Official Journal Since its still a relatively new cartridge, most hunters probably dont know very much at all about the 6mm Creedmoor. Why I'm Not Buying 6mm Creedmoor Ron Spomer Outdoors This means I will earn a small commission (at no extra cost to you) if you make a purchase. Flattening The Curve With Hornady's 6mm ARC - Gun Digest Before we get started, I have an administrative note: Some of the links below are affiliate links. Cal. 22-250 vs 223 vs 204 RUGER vs 220 SWIFT: CLASH OF THE SPEED DEMONS. An excellent choice of6mm Creedmoor ammo for hunting deer and pronghorn, the LRX BT still offers effective terminal performance and the deep penetration on larger game thats essential when elk and red stag hunting. The table below compares compares the 3 cartridges using Hornady Precision Hunter ammo along with 2 max handloads for the 243 and 6mm Creedmoor using a 100gr InterLock taken from the Hornady reloading handbook. Many of these are match bullets like the Hornady ELD Match, the Berger VLD, or other boat tail hollow point (BTHP) and open tip match (OTM) bullets that arent ideal for big game hunters. We still have a long way to go and selection is still nowhere near where it was back in 2019, but things are a lot better now than they were even 6 months ago. The 6.5 Creedmoor commonly uses 120gr, 140gr, and 143gr bullets. Heres why: First and foremost, the new ARC is designed to be more durable than its predecessor. In addition, it comes with a two-year warranty from HORI one of the longest warranties in the business. So an 6mm ARC @58k psi might get there. The chart below compares how much a 10 mile per hour crosswind impacts those same loads for each cartridge out to 500 yards. Your email address will not be published. Even though the two InterLock loads use the exact same bullet, the 6mm Creedmoor does still have an advantage in wind drift over the 243 since it fires that bullet at a faster initial velocity. That hornady chart looks to line up exactly where my numbers are. The ARC is an incredibly versatile round that can be used for hunting a wide variety of game animals. Both of these calibers have their pros and cons, but in the end, the 6.5 Creedmoor is a better choice for most shooters. The Perfect 6.5 mm Cartridge The 6.5 mm Super LR is a 6.5 mm wildcat cartridge with a powder capacity of 55.5 gr of water weight (i.e. Hornady introduced 6mm Creedmoor factory ammo loaded with match and hunting bullets in early 2017. What the 6mm Creedmoor absolutely excels at though, is those same small to medium CXP2 type animals, but at long range, with consistently expanding high-BC match bullets like the Hornady 108gr ELD-M or the Berger 105gr Hybrid Target. The 6mm ARC's exterior ballistics are good, enough thanks to its use of high BC projectiles, to allow it to run with the .308 Winchester when shooting long. There are a few things that could potentially shorten its lifespan, but there are also many factors that suggest it will be around for a long time. Most 243 Win. All the die manufacturers including Hornady, Lyman, Redding, RCBS and other make 6mm Creedmoor Dies, but out of all of them that I have used, I still prefer the Redding as the best 6mm Creedmoor Dies for sale, because of the quality of the product, and then the design of the expander which works very well for me. 6mm CM is over 200fps faster even pushing the ARC with a more compressed load. Interestingly, there is a surprisingly good selection of factory loaded 6mm Creedmoor ammunition these days. 6 dasher or 6 Creedmoor | Shooters' Forum The biggest advantage of the Creedmoor is its versatility. and 240 Wby. The fact that this was said on such a knowledgeable forum, with no objection by anybody and the first person to mention that such a reamer has been made before by PT&G was in 2010 on that thread. Anyone used the Crossroad Archery Stabilizers? The general rule of thumb for caliber to animal size, is 6mm, 243 Win, 270 Win and up for any smaller CXP2 type antelope, and 30-06 Spingfield or larger for CXP3 medium to large game. 6mm Dasher - PrecisionRifleBlog.com Both loads recoil a whole lot less than a 143gr Hornady ELD-X from a 6.5 Creedmoor. Not only are these LRX BT bullets specifically designed for the best aerodynamic performance possible, but they still offer the devastating terminal performance and high weight retention under a variety of hunting situations that Barnes bullets are known for. Bill, Appreciate your input. 6mm ARC - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc Other shooters took notice of how well the rifle and cartridge performed during PRS competitions that year and began ordering 6mm Creedmoor rifles from Gardner. Looking at the immense popularity of the 6mm Creedmoor in recent years, especially in the PRS racegun and other fieldshoot type competitions, the availability of factory ammo and factory chambered rifles in it, it would appear to be here to stay, with many claiming it displacing the legendary .243 Winchester. Shooters also cannot use bullets larger than .308 or with a velocity higher than 3,200 feet per second. My best guess I'd say a 6mm CM out of a 18" barrel would push a 108 ELDM around 2850 fps. Barnes currently offers their VOR-TX LR line of ammunition in 6mm Creedmoor and its another great choice for big game hunters who want the best possible performance at extended range for hunting. For the sake of discussion, why do you believe that the ARC will overtake the Grendel? The Hornady 6mm ARC | Midsouth Shooters Find Reply Dino11 Member Posts: 350 Threads: 33 Joined: Jul 2020 #2 Its bigger and more popular than ever before, with new tournaments and leagues popping up all the time. This is especially trueif youre currently having a tough time finding ammo for other similar cartridges (like 243 Winchester). Like this unbelieveable 6mm Creedmoor of PRS Pro Shooter Jake Millard from Panhandle Precision who has recorded 2500 rounds through his 6mm Creedmoor and the rifle is still grouping well and shooting very low SD and ES as can be seen below: For safe reliable reloading data to start your load development journey with your 6mm Creedmoor, I would recommend working with the reloading data provided by either your powder manufacturer, like the Hodgdon reloading data portal, or the reloading data provided by your chosen bullet manufacturer. 224 Valkyrie and 6mm ARC have an identical overall length The case length of the 224 Valkyrie is slightly longer than the case of the 6mm ARC The case capacity of the 224 Valkyrie is one-half grain more than 6mm ARC The maximum loading pressure, according to SAAMI, is 3,000 psi higher for 224 Valkyrie than 6mm ARC The Big Game Hunting Blog is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.ca, Amazon.com.au, and other Amazon stores worldwide. Re: 6XC vs. 6mm Creedmoor Both Copper Creek and McCort amunition have several loadings for the 6mm Creedmoor on properly headstamped brass. For that reason, Hornady offers the 6mm Creedmoor as part of their Varmint Express line of ammo. The bullet leaving the muzzle causes the felt recoil. The 6mm ARC is basically the 6.5 Grendel necked down to hold a .243" bullet with the 30-degree shoulder pushed back a smidgen. The 6mm ARC also performs better in wind. Thats understandable because, while the new cartridge has performed very well during practical shooting competitions since its introduction, the 6mm Creedmoor only started making the transition into the hunting community in the last couple of years. 243 wssm, very accurate, very tough brass, 87 vmax at 3200 from a 22" barrel. BR GT Dasher all fine established cartridges but Brass and no factory rifle availability shows there limited appeal. The problem is that Hornady, which developed the 6 mm ARC, made a slight alteration to the case length so that it would be compatible with very long 6 mm bullets that have a high BC. At 1,000 yards, the 6mm Creedmoor drifts about a foot more than the 6 . Grendel is a great cartridge, is the 6mm ARC that much better? 6.5 Grendel. Video marketing. Definitely not worth arguing. 6mm ARC too slow for PRS? - Calguns.net They decide that with their own hard-earned money. 6mm ARC vs .223 Rem: Cartridge Clash - RifleShooter ?This told me that felt recoil is not as much about numbers as it is about the person pulling the trigger. 6ARC will be cool if Howa ever sells it as a barreled action on their mini action. Dont underestimate the impact that recoil has on the ability of a person to shoot accurately either. Thankfully though, there are many companies now including Hornady, Peterson, Starline and a few more, making 6mm Creedmoor brass cases. It offers the same stability factor as the industry-leading 105gr Hybrid Target and is a direct replacement for 1:8" twist barrels. Gardner realized that the 6mm Creedmoor fit the bill perfectly for PRS use, so he modified an AR-10 to use the new cartridge. 6mm ARC vs 243: Cartridge Comparison by Ammo.com It also has a relatively low muzzle velocity, so it is not as effective at long range as some other calibers. Take a look at any good ballistics program Hornady and Federal both have an easy-to-use program on their websitesand you'll see the advantage of the better B.C. So where do we stand overall with the .243 Winchester, 6mm Creedmoor, and 6.5mm Creedmoor? Overall a superb if not one of the best PRS and racegun competition cartridges. This makes it an excellent choice for long-range shooting, as it will maintain its velocity and energy over long distances. The only place where it was always claimed that the .243 Winchester won the 6mm Creedmoor, was with ammo availability. The Lapua cartridges are for handloaders only, but Hornady offers match-grade 6mm and 6.5 Creedmoor ammunition. Case capacity of the 6mm PPC is about 33 grains of water. Why would a guy opt for the ARC over the Creedmoor in a bolt action? 6mm ARC | Review of the Hornady Cartridge for the AR-15 Platform We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to amazon.com and affiliated sites. More so people are about telling others what round is better for whatever reason with no real study conducted. The difference between the .243 Winchester and the 6mm Creedmoor can indeed make the difference in a tightly contested shooting match, but the gap between them is small enough that very few hunters will notice afield. The same goes for rifles. Unfortunately, were not living in normal times as I write this in September 2021. Alex Pro Firearm - Alexandria Minnesota - APF Armory Required fields are marked *. I had always been told you need a certain length barrel for certain calibers. I shot a prs match with that setup back in September. It delivers less drop, less wind deflection and the ability to shoot accurate groups at much greater distance (1000+ yds). Image shows 6.5 Grendel cartridge, parent case of the 6mm ARC. Another factor to consider when choosing a caliber is recoil. We do deal with a lot of different cartridges and firearms so either he or I could be getting the numbers mixed up. Cartridge Specs: 6.5 Creedmoor Vs. 6mm Creedmoor Understanding a cartridge's capabilities always begins with basic knowledge of the physical properties of the cartridge. The 6mm Creedmoorin the same fashion of its larger counterpartfits those bullets very well. Loaded with a high BC 103 grain ELD-X bullet, 6mm Creedmoor Precision Hunter ammunition has a flatter trajectory and carries more energy down range than any other factory loads for 6mm Creedmoor hunting ammo currently available. The designers of the 6ARC wanted to create a round that would compete with the famous 223/5.56 in an AR platform, but it needed to shoot flatter at long-range. DONATE TO THE CHANNELPayPal: bullets4bucks@gmail.comFOLLOW USFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/bullets4bucksTwitter: https://www.twitter.com/bullets4bucksInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/bullets4bucksBullets4Bucks is a product of Pure Wyoming Productions LLC, an Wyoming Limited Liability Company#onxhunt #truproducts #proforsho #hunting #deerhunting #elkhunting #howa1500 #athlonoptics #bearhunting #antelopehunting #huntingvideos #hunt #vortexoptics #bullets4bucks #publiclandowner This will give you a good, safe starting minimum load to work upwards from. I shoot 105 Berger hybrids from mr 6br but dont hunt with it to know what damage they do. The .220 Swift's effective distance came in at 275 yards. The ability to make rapid follow up shots and quickly correct for misses is also extremely important. This data is for Hornady handloads and HornadyPrecision Hunter factory ammo using a 200 yard zero and a 24 barrel. Which it does pretty well within those limitations. Actors are trained firearms professionals. Switch my 6.5 Creedmoor for 6mm ARC on Florida Hogs It and the 6mm Remington have the horsepower to best the 6mm Creedmoor, but the Creed has the rifling twist, so let's use its ballistics to compare against its parent, the 6.5 Creedmoor. For this reason, the 6mm Creedmoor has less recoil and a generally flatter trajectory, but the heavier and larger diameter 6.5 Creedmoor bullets have more frontal surface area, more resistance to wind drift, and carry more energy down range. Not much info out there on them. For all the reasons mentioned is why I went with a 6x47 Lapua for a bolt gun. New 6mm AR cartridge: 6mm ARC - AR15.COM While the 6mm Creedmoor was very popular among PRS competitors, thats a relatively small market compared to the American shooting population as a whole. bullets. People quickly make jokes about the 6.5 Creedmoor cartridge when they hear a shooter has it, but you never hear anybody joke about the 6mm Creedmoor, as there is no denying the seriousness of a 108gr ELD-M bullet charging down range at 3100+ fps. 6MM ARC vs 6.5 Grendel - Sportsman's 6mm ARC vs 6.5 Grendel - Performance Comparison - The Lodge at AmmoToGo.com The Brass is better than 1/2 Price and easily available. Its large case capacity gave it a slight ballistic advantage . Your buddy has no idea what he's talking about. With the numbers we use, it appears these cartridges each have their advantages. For a long time I have wondered about how barrel length affected velocity. at 2,960 fps. John Snows article for Outdoor Life was used as a reference for the history of the 6mm Creedmoor. The .223 does have advantages, though. You are using an out of date browser. If we look at the debate of the 6mm Creedmoor vs 6.5 Creedmoor for PRS shooting and competitions, both have their own merits. You must log in or register to reply here. Felt recoil will vary from shooter to shooter and rifle to rifle, but free recoil energy is still a useful way to compare cartridges. At this instant, I can find 3 different loads for it in-stock, which is more than I can say for the majority of other cartridges right now. Heres how each cartridge compares directly to the others in general terms. Because a real avid shooter loads his own ammo for various reasons. Someone keeps forgetting to tell John Whidden that he cant spank the Creedmore fanboys at the Wimbledon matches with his 20 deg shoulder, low pressureed, overly tapered 243 Win. Hornady's new 108 ELD-Match needs a twist of 1:8. The 6mm Advanced Rifle Cartridge (638mm), or 6mm ARC for short, is a 6 mm (.243) caliber intermediate rifle cartridge introduced by Hornady in 2020, as a low- recoil, high- accuracy long-range cartridge, designed for use in the AR-15 platform at request of a specialized group within the U.S. DoD for its multipurpose combat rifle program. All in all, this is outstanding 6mm Creedmoor ammo for hunting medium game like deer and pronghorn. These factors make the 6mm Creedmoor very forgiving of range and wind estimation errors while at the same time helping to maximize the shooting abilities of the hunter to the greatest possible extent. First off, the 6mm? The only way that works is if his arc barrel is very fast and the creed is super slow and loaded light, similar pressures the creed will outperform the arc every time now the arc will be more efficient. That is not cast in concrete however and many larger CXP3 animal have been taken with 6mm Creedmoors, but usually either at long range with high-shoulder shots, or close range with headshots, but this is not recommended. rifles come with 1:10 twists, which are not quite quick enough to stabilize today's longest, highest B.C. Its accuracy and power make it more than capable of taking down even the most elusive prey. The question of whether or not the new ARC will last has been on everyones mind since it was first announced. That being said, if a guy wanted to push that type of speed and bullet weight, the 6mm Creedmoor is a better solution in my opinion. The 6mm Creedmoor can use the same lighter weight bullets as the .243 Winchester and fire them a bit faster (around 200fps with typical factory loads). Is the 6mm Creedmoor the latest flavor of the week that will fade when the next big fad comes along? JavaScript is disabled. Always follow manufacturers instructions. The 6mm Remington was built with a new factory load of 100 grain and was said to have an exit velocity of 3,190 fps. Lastly, I am . Maximum pressure obtained from SAAMI (p23 and p26 for the .243 and 6.5 Creed) and here for the 6mm Creedmoor.